Are you kidding me bro? After 4 years of socialist economic policy and trickle up poverty by “spreading the wealth around” we’ll see how much everybody loves this man so much. The true colors of the democratic party will definitely come to light now that Harry Reid and Nut-Job-Nancy Pelosi have a stranglehold on Capitol Hill with a President who has a background that’s just plain frightening.
Not that McCain was any better but at least I didn’t question his very citizenship of America. Both parties are broken…the whole system is broken. We get to vote between basically a nominated fall-guy, and a man with no substance who just keeps saying the word change…marvelous.
I could go on and on. You know I still love you bro, but yeah, pretty much totally disagree with you on this one.
At least the proposition voting in CA went pretty well…at least I think it did.
1. We (that is, the majority of us) elected a black President. That alone is proof that change can happen. As recently as 40 years ago, that would have been a pipe dream.
2. Young people (and the population in general) got out and voted like they never have before. For the first time in my life I’ve seen a huge increase in political interest among my peers, and I include myself in this.
I don’t intend to get into a debate about socialism or redistribution of wealth, but I personally am willing to pay more taxes if that means that more people will get better healthcare or have access to better social programs. I believe in doing the most good for the most people, so if you want to call me a socialist, go ahead. In general, I agreed with Obama’s policies over McCain’s, which is the primary reason I voted for him.
Now, do you really genuinely question Obama’s citizenship? I would think that a diversified background would make someone more qualified for the office of President, not less. What evidence do we have that McCain is any better of a citizen than Obama? His military service? I don’t deny that it is commendable, but I also don’t see how it automatically makes him more trustworthy.
Now, for one of my major issues with McCain – his running mate. I can’t even to begin to imagine what state the nation would be in if something happened to McCain and Sarah Palin became President. Not that this should validate my vote for Obama (I could have voted for one of the other candidates), but as I already mentioned, I generally agree with Obama’s positions.
As for the propositions, you can read my views on facebook or Chad’s website.
Thanks for the comment though, Ben. I generally appreciate opposing views, as long as they’re constructive.
On November 6, 2008 at 4:31 pm Ben said,
Yeah, not wanting to be an ass in a silly GOP vs. Democrat battle. I personally believe the GOP hasn’t produced a legitimately conservative candidate in many years. Lately I have been seriously considering re-registering myself as an Independent to be completely honest.
Anyways. 1. Yeah I guess but are we really still tied up about race that we are proud that a black man was elected just because he is black? I mean I don’t think this was the case for you, but I believe that many people voted for Obama simply because he was black…but that’s just a hunch…but w/e thats not really an issue to me.
2. Yeah this is a good thing because it was getting pretty annoying hearing people complain about the state of things…yet they didn’t vote.
Regarding the citizenship point. Yes, I think there is a valid case that Obama’s actual citizenship is questionable (which was recently denied I believe by the Supreme Court for no just cause because Obama wasn’t an elected president yet….or something the verdict slips my mind right now). This story will probably get revisited before he is sworn in. Anyways yes I believe this creates legitimate concern.
Yeah, McCain tried to pull a total media stunt when he chose a female running mate. I already thought the GOP nomination was a major mistake and then he pulled that crap. For the record I voted for Huckabee in the primary’s, a close second in my opinion was Romney.
But the main thing is that I disagree with so many points of Obama’s political views. With his views and with a very far left capitol hill running the show, I think there are some major changes, you as a Christian, will find worrisome in the coming years. I mean at least with the Clinton administration there was a conservative congress to counter balance things. Not the case for these 4 years. I fully expect the entire checks and balances system to go out the window.
Frankly, I find it tough to believe that Christians can really say they are in support of a leftist ideology. Not to say that if you are liberal that makes you anti-Christian, or any less of a Christian. There are some fundamental points that have taken a firm hold in that party in the past 10-20 years that I really find tough for a Christian to stomach. Yes I know that we are individuals are not defined by our political views.
Regardless of political affiliation, it is comforting knowing that our true allegiance does not lie to anything of this world, but to our heavenly Father. It just seems as if this country is straying further and further away from that and that greatly concerns me how much longer God will bless our country.
Anyways, none of this is a personal attack. I just found it pretty surprising..though we never really talked politics before so I guess its not all that surprising heh.
Do you mean you would “decline to state” a party affiliation, or do you actually mean the American Independent party? In either case, I would understand the desire, but then you wouldn’t be able to vote in the primaries, so I would consider it strongly before actually making the switch.
With regards to 1, I believe it’s possible that some voted for Obama on the basis of race, but from what I have read in Time (which I take with a grain of salt), the economy played a much bigger role in influencing voter’s decisions than race.
I would also agree that McCain was trying to win support by picking a female running mate, but the fact that he did indicated to me that he was more concerned about votes than who his right hand would be. Obama could have selected Hilary and united the Dems, but (in my opinion) he chose a running mate based on qualification, not voter sympathy.
There may be some changes that I might find worrisome, but as I’ve already said, I agree with Obama on a lot of his policies, so as long as his personal policies remain the same, I think we’ll be okay. This could be because I generally have a more “liberal” take on a lot of issues, but I always weigh moral or ethical issues against my Christianity, and I wouldn’t vote for something that doesn’t jive with that. You can ask me more specific questions about that if you like, and I’ll do my best to answer them.
And like I said, I appreciate your honesty and your opinions, and I’ve been in a lot of these conversations lately, so I don’t take anything personally.
It’s funny how these kinds of things never came up before though. I would say that I was somewhat apathetic in college, but getting married and being in grad school has challenged a lot of my previous assumptions and forced me to defend (and sometimes rethink) a lot of my beliefs.
Comments
Ben said,
Are you kidding me bro? After 4 years of socialist economic policy and trickle up poverty by “spreading the wealth around” we’ll see how much everybody loves this man so much. The true colors of the democratic party will definitely come to light now that Harry Reid and Nut-Job-Nancy Pelosi have a stranglehold on Capitol Hill with a President who has a background that’s just plain frightening.
Not that McCain was any better but at least I didn’t question his very citizenship of America. Both parties are broken…the whole system is broken. We get to vote between basically a nominated fall-guy, and a man with no substance who just keeps saying the word change…marvelous.
I could go on and on. You know I still love you bro, but yeah, pretty much totally disagree with you on this one.
At least the proposition voting in CA went pretty well…at least I think it did.
troyal said,
Here are two reasons why I’m proud:
1. We (that is, the majority of us) elected a black President. That alone is proof that change can happen. As recently as 40 years ago, that would have been a pipe dream.
2. Young people (and the population in general) got out and voted like they never have before. For the first time in my life I’ve seen a huge increase in political interest among my peers, and I include myself in this.
I don’t intend to get into a debate about socialism or redistribution of wealth, but I personally am willing to pay more taxes if that means that more people will get better healthcare or have access to better social programs. I believe in doing the most good for the most people, so if you want to call me a socialist, go ahead. In general, I agreed with Obama’s policies over McCain’s, which is the primary reason I voted for him.
Now, do you really genuinely question Obama’s citizenship? I would think that a diversified background would make someone more qualified for the office of President, not less. What evidence do we have that McCain is any better of a citizen than Obama? His military service? I don’t deny that it is commendable, but I also don’t see how it automatically makes him more trustworthy.
Now, for one of my major issues with McCain – his running mate. I can’t even to begin to imagine what state the nation would be in if something happened to McCain and Sarah Palin became President. Not that this should validate my vote for Obama (I could have voted for one of the other candidates), but as I already mentioned, I generally agree with Obama’s positions.
As for the propositions, you can read my views on facebook or Chad’s website.
Thanks for the comment though, Ben. I generally appreciate opposing views, as long as they’re constructive.
Ben said,
Yeah, not wanting to be an ass in a silly GOP vs. Democrat battle. I personally believe the GOP hasn’t produced a legitimately conservative candidate in many years. Lately I have been seriously considering re-registering myself as an Independent to be completely honest.
Anyways. 1. Yeah I guess but are we really still tied up about race that we are proud that a black man was elected just because he is black? I mean I don’t think this was the case for you, but I believe that many people voted for Obama simply because he was black…but that’s just a hunch…but w/e thats not really an issue to me.
2. Yeah this is a good thing because it was getting pretty annoying hearing people complain about the state of things…yet they didn’t vote.
Regarding the citizenship point. Yes, I think there is a valid case that Obama’s actual citizenship is questionable (which was recently denied I believe by the Supreme Court for no just cause because Obama wasn’t an elected president yet….or something the verdict slips my mind right now). This story will probably get revisited before he is sworn in. Anyways yes I believe this creates legitimate concern.
Yeah, McCain tried to pull a total media stunt when he chose a female running mate. I already thought the GOP nomination was a major mistake and then he pulled that crap. For the record I voted for Huckabee in the primary’s, a close second in my opinion was Romney.
But the main thing is that I disagree with so many points of Obama’s political views. With his views and with a very far left capitol hill running the show, I think there are some major changes, you as a Christian, will find worrisome in the coming years. I mean at least with the Clinton administration there was a conservative congress to counter balance things. Not the case for these 4 years. I fully expect the entire checks and balances system to go out the window.
Frankly, I find it tough to believe that Christians can really say they are in support of a leftist ideology. Not to say that if you are liberal that makes you anti-Christian, or any less of a Christian. There are some fundamental points that have taken a firm hold in that party in the past 10-20 years that I really find tough for a Christian to stomach. Yes I know that we are individuals are not defined by our political views.
Regardless of political affiliation, it is comforting knowing that our true allegiance does not lie to anything of this world, but to our heavenly Father. It just seems as if this country is straying further and further away from that and that greatly concerns me how much longer God will bless our country.
Anyways, none of this is a personal attack. I just found it pretty surprising..though we never really talked politics before so I guess its not all that surprising heh.
troyal said,
Do you mean you would “decline to state” a party affiliation, or do you actually mean the American Independent party? In either case, I would understand the desire, but then you wouldn’t be able to vote in the primaries, so I would consider it strongly before actually making the switch.
With regards to 1, I believe it’s possible that some voted for Obama on the basis of race, but from what I have read in Time (which I take with a grain of salt), the economy played a much bigger role in influencing voter’s decisions than race.
On 2, we agree.
As for Obama’s citizenship, let me direct you to http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/citizen.asp and http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2008/06/obama-birth.html . It seems to me that his citizenship is a non-issue (however I understand your concern prior to seeing this document).
I would also agree that McCain was trying to win support by picking a female running mate, but the fact that he did indicated to me that he was more concerned about votes than who his right hand would be. Obama could have selected Hilary and united the Dems, but (in my opinion) he chose a running mate based on qualification, not voter sympathy.
There may be some changes that I might find worrisome, but as I’ve already said, I agree with Obama on a lot of his policies, so as long as his personal policies remain the same, I think we’ll be okay. This could be because I generally have a more “liberal” take on a lot of issues, but I always weigh moral or ethical issues against my Christianity, and I wouldn’t vote for something that doesn’t jive with that. You can ask me more specific questions about that if you like, and I’ll do my best to answer them.
And like I said, I appreciate your honesty and your opinions, and I’ve been in a lot of these conversations lately, so I don’t take anything personally.
It’s funny how these kinds of things never came up before though. I would say that I was somewhat apathetic in college, but getting married and being in grad school has challenged a lot of my previous assumptions and forced me to defend (and sometimes rethink) a lot of my beliefs.